Interested in an ARM-based laptop?

On a related issue: I’d like to have the laptop but also need a functioning browser that allows me to access bank websites (among others). Where are we with a browser to meet this requirement. I did use the Firefox on RISC OS but found it too slow (on our limited connection – but suspect it had much to do with the browser)

That was covered in RISC OS Developments’ talk. In short, there’s funding for a browser but it’s a challenge to find developers.

If a RISC OS system had a multicore processor, would the other cores be able to run an android system in a similar way to windows on a RISC PC? (Providing missing apps and handling wireless networking)

Of course, you can dwell on 1001 reasons not to buy something. Or you can join the party on what is arguably the most exciting step forward for RISC OS for 20+ years. Your choice :)

I do appreciate the rather momentous nature of the first RO laptop in those 20+ years and to be honest the browser mentioned above is actually a minor item.
Keyboard – keycap changes is good. If you could produce a graphic of the existing marked with the modifications, given the two different keyboards on the 11.6" and 14" models the changes could be interesting. You will note that I’m not alone in disliking the trans-pond layout.

Wireless is in the pipeline so add a known good USB to the price perhaps.

I’m still interested (14"), given the assurances about keycaps.

In short, there’s funding for a browser but it’s a challenge to find developers.

I’ve watched the video, but only in short bursts – the kids kept disturbing me ;-)

I was initially upset/concerned at how Richard described the turn of events which lead to the halt in browser development. It’s good that some development took place at all.

Given where we are now in terms of licencing of the OS, it certainly would be interesting if former/current developers will review their commitments and perhaps take up the reins?

I’ve not watched any of the other videos yet, but indications suggest a very positive turn of events from what has happened this week :-)

One thing that was mentioned by Andrew that I have not seen mentioned here is that the laptop will be dual bootable as in essence the base provided Linux set up will be retained so that you can switch between both as a boot option.

I think it may be that RISC OS is on the SDCard and if that is either removed or a switchable boot option added then that would be the way to get at using the initially the other application where required.

Not ideal but means the laptop can be used in multiple modes.

Doesn’t Elesar provide a similar option for the Titanium with either Linux or RISC OS available?

And before any one says, RISC OS is running natively not in emulation mode as previously mentioned.

Steve, I thought I wrote this in previous post, but I think I must be delirious again – sorry. We’ll be including a USB ethernet adapter with every laptop, at least until wireless gets done. You won’t be paying extra for it, beyond whatever price we finalise for the unit itself.

And the other-screen-size laptop (12") just arrived on my doorstep! It was supposed to be at the show, but just overshot. Ah well. At least I’ll now be able to test both and report back.

Steve, I thought I wrote this in previous post, but I think I must be delirious again – sorry.

If you’ve got that horrible cold/flu that’s going around then prepare for it lingering for a few weeks.

We’ll be including a USB ethernet adapter with every laptop, at least until wireless gets done. You won’t be paying extra for it, beyond whatever price we finalise for the unit itself.

The inclusion is beyond what I’d expected in the guideline price, especially given the usual R-Comp continuing service, but definitely good news to hear it’s all planned in.
I’ve been saving for a while so provided the other half is in receipt of an appropriate size xmas item or two I’m OK.

It will be interesting to see the impact of a wireless driver in the OS for other boards icluding ones without a current OS port.

;-) I’d be interested in one of these laptops with a 14" (matte) screen with a UK keyboard…

I’d be interested in one of these laptops with a 14"

It’s at this point that Andrew R probably wishes he had a tame web support guy putting together a page for people to register their interest, contact details, bank account and blood type. OK, maybe not all of those…

Well, um, I’m interested but don’t have the money… Nor do I know my blood type… Hmm, I think I’m going to fail this test…

I will enquire about the volumes needed for UK keyboard. Don’t hold your breath though, as manufacturing times seem slow enough already. Unfortunately, I suspect there isn’t the volume to justify pushing through a separate manufacturing job just for UK keyboard models. Perhaps they could be sold as Linux units too in the UK, but…

Quick feedback on the slightly smaller unit – it is a touch smaller, although larger screen bezels. Screen is much nicer – bright and clear and, well, all the colour accuracy you get with IPS. This isn’t about viewing angles, it is about screen and colour quality. I love IPS panels as most of you will know, so perhaps I am biased, but it does look good.

Keyboard seems complete, no obviously missing keys compared to 14" unit (at first glance), so I don’t think there are any significant downsides to it. Except that RISC OS didn’t boot immediately on it, so we’ll need to have a little look into that.

to justify pushing through a separate manufacturing job just for UK keyboard models

? Isn’t the keyboard just a clip-in panel like most other laptops I’ve come across?

Here’s my EeePC’s keyboard:

Note carefully the Windows key (lower left). It’s a circle with a picture of a home in it. It’s a replacement that I got from eBay after the original started to act up. Two slots at the bottom, and three clips along the back, plus a ribbon cable to connect it to the motherboard. The squiggles are thanks to add-on key labels.

Surely the Pinebook uses a similar arrangement, or how would they plan to support alternative key mappings should they decide to branch out to other countries? I don’t think they’d get particularly far in France if they’re going to be proposing an American keyboard!

Screen is much nicer – bright and clear and, well, all the colour accuracy you get with IPS.

Forget colour accuracy for the moment (it isn’t as if RISC OS can play movies!) and do one simple trick… sorry, I mean test…
Should the sun deign to make itself visible, walk both machines outside. Put them on a bench. Power up.
Okay, now which one can you see? Which one can you work with? Which one isn’t going to drive you mad with barely-visible or washed out display, reflections, and general nastiness that one encounters when using visual display devices outside…

Except that RISC OS didn’t boot immediately on it

Yeah, but that RISC OS boots at all… A modern RISC OS laptop, holy sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee…….

Nor do I know my blood type… Hmm, I think I’m going to fail this test…

I’ll have to check at Phlebotomy, but I didn’t know you could fail a blood test.

This isn’t about viewing angles, it is about screen and colour quality. I love IPS panels

OK, we’ll all ask for 14" IPS :^)

BTW, the London show URL redirects to talk TalkTalk with a “we’re closing down this stuff” message, and trying to continue throws up a 403 Forbidden.

TalkTalk deleted my 8-bit BeebControl website (along with the many others they were hosting) because they were ‘no longer interested in web hosting’. It’s taken me a couple of months to find a suitable new web host, but BeebControl can now be found at http://www.riscy.uk/beebcontrol/

The ‘riscy’ bit in the web address is because I really really really intend to put up a Riscy Robots version soon too, covering 32-bit stuff. (Been saying that for about five years now.)

I’ve watched some reviews on YouTube of the Pinebook(s) and they look like a cheaper, but slightly better build quality version of the pi-top. A very similar keyboard and trackpad, essentially cheap and cheerful with multi-touch. The screen is the same resolution as well.

At less than £100 including shipping (+VAT) to the UK for either model, it’s certainly a bargain. Spec wise, the CPU is near enough identical to the Pi3, but it does appear you can replace the board with a higher spec model – which won’t affect RISCOS, but might be useful if you’re using it for Linux.

TalkTalk deleted my 8-bit BeebControl website (along with the many others they were hosting) because they were ‘no longer interested in web hosting’.

Given that the accounts dept for TalkTalk are probably the second most inept¹ set of prime to….s I’ve ever dealt with they probably forgot to pay the people doing the hosting and then faced with a large cost just dropped the service.

¹ First prize there goes to the staff at Virgin that seem to have remained in place² when the VM/NTL merger occurred.
² I’ve had dealings with NTL who failed to bill me on the direct debit for 4 years of phone and broadband and then tried to bill me for the three month period after I moved with their bill starting from the date of the cease instruction I gave them.
In Virgin Media guise their accounts department created about a dozen attempts at a quote for an MPLS service starting with one with all the costs in twice but because they lifted the spreadsheet table into Word and then edited the Word table each time they lost out on the nice feature of spreadsheets doing the mathematics for you and clearly ran out of fingers for the counting. The last version was the one where they finally managed to stop adding the VAT from the first attempt.

Jon, that price is nothing like accurate, I’m afraid. My last bill came to closer to 200 than 100. Thankyou UK customs. Yes. There’s a VAT story there, and it’s…. well, there’s a reason noone likes that government department.

It’s also massively sleeker, nicer etc than PiTop based on people talking at the show. It’s a proper laptop not a board-in-a-box.

the accounts dept for TalkTalk are probably the second most inept1 set of prime to….s

Seconded. They constitute the reason why TalkTalk is no longer my ISP and never will be again. It makes me angry just to think about it again, and it was years ago.

But we digress…

Andrew, I know it’s early days, but do you foresee being able to sell a “DIY” version of the software for people that already own a Pinebook? Living in NZ it’ll probably be cheaper for me to buy one directly instead of going via the UK – one set of shipping and no VAT!

Same here in switzerland. I’ d also like to pay for the software, instead of very high customs fee for traveling the pinebook from country to country..

In practise, for non-EU countries (esp Aus) I doubt much difference due to us being VAT registered. We don’t have to charge VAT when shipping to non-EU countries, so residents of those countries often save massively compared to UK. I single out Aus because the GST import limit is quite high (at least 1000 Aus$) so you can often save both VAT and duty! This typically makes computers about 50ukp cheaper than to the UK!

I need time to sort everything out, and won’t be able to commit to that until I know our unit prices. The “software” cost would be “RRP less hardware cost”. Of course, this may still come back to bite you as we’ll need to ship something to you to avoid charging VAT – we have to show proof of export.

This is why I say, it may be more trouble than it is actually worth to do what you ask – the end result saving to you might well be no more than about 15ukp for significantly more hassle. Plus, we wouldn’t be able to test/configure/warranty. We will see how things go.

Right now, we just need time to work on the project quietly for a month or so, and get things finished.

In practise, for non-EU countries (esp Aus) I doubt much difference due to us being VAT registered. We don’t have to charge VAT when shipping to non-EU countries, so residents of those countries often save massively compared to UK.

They would still have to pay the local equivalent of VAT though, so any massive saving would only come from the difference between the local rate and the UK’s 20% rate.

I single out Aus because the GST import limit is quite high (at least 1000 Aus$) so you can often save both VAT and duty!

Sadly that changed in July 2018 so it’s GST for everyone on everything. Governments seem to be scratching round for every last tax dollar these days…

Of course, this may still come back to bite you as we’ll need to ship something to you to avoid charging VAT – we have to show proof of export.

We had the first installment of a ~ £500,000 system shipped to us in an A4 envelop just before end of financial year a few years back because Finance wouldn’t GRS the invoice without us signing that we something we could hold in our hand that was part of the system. The install documents and the software license seemed to fit the bill.
So what’s the portion of the cost you were going to attribute to the license certificate?