TBA Software

The Slitaz linux has just released a javascript and flash capable browser from webkit that is only a 24 KBb binary.

That’s just for “main.c”, which on its own does nothing useful. It requires GTK and WebKit, which are linked as external libraries and are very much larger than 24K.

It requires GTK and WebKit

D’oh!

I quite like Netsurf and it has potential. For now the certificate errors when using RISC OS 5.17 need fixing, as do the crashes when alignment errors are turned on.

Remember that AFAIK none of the NetSurf developers (even the RISC OS one) have access to a Beagleboard, so fixing ARMv7-specific bugs is going to happen slowly unless someone who does have a Beagleboard comes forward with a more constructive report than “It crashes; fix it!” I’m more than happy to look at the problem, time permitting, but unless I suddenly decide that I can’t live without an ARMini (which is unlikely) I’ll need some assistance.

Java is probably the biggest thing required for this project.

Really? I’d have thought that these days Javascript might have been significantly more useful (and that’s on the roadmap). YMMV.

I have no idea what ever happened to the Acorn version of Java?

No ongoing development and licensing issues, IIRC.

AFAIK Google like to use Java within their Apps and Docs system that we use for our website and email – but yes of course Javascript is much more widely used.

With Netsurf the bug was already on the bug-tracker already when I checked. The pop up message is “error setting certificate verify locations:” and it won’t load the page. This I think is all pages referencing an SSL certificate in some way – including rather unfortunately the home page of this website :-) I wondered if a variable needed setting or a module loading, but I’m completely unfamiliar with Netsurf to have any idea where to start looking.

AFAIK Google like to use Java within their Apps and Docs system […]

Maybe, but that’s another issue entirely. Java on RISC OS seems unlikely in the foreseeable future anyway, for the reasons outlined above, and that will affect any browser used on the platform.

With Netsurf the bug was already on the bug-tracker already when I checked. The pop up message is “error setting certificate verify locations:” and it won’t load the page.

Yes, I know; I’ve just gone back to re-read the ticket and associated email messages in case I’d forgotten some details. I hadn’t: there doesn’t seem to be enough there to sensibly start to investigate without access to a Beagleboard. A copy of a logfile that contains details of the problem (assuming that they get logged, that is) would be a start, but I couldn’t see one.

This I think is all pages referencing an SSL certificate in some way – including rather unfortunately the home page of this website :-)

The problem is that, on the RISC OS systems I have access to, NetSurf accesses this website just fine. This means that if I’m to look at the problem over and above bugs that I can reproduce, I’m going to require more info so that it doesn’t turn into a needle-hunt.

Sure, there is never enough time in the day to fix all the bugs! I’ll do my best to dig up some information. I’m suspecting something is missing from the vanilla OMAP 5.17 / HardDisc4 builds – it’s tricky to know where to start looking for things relating to SSL certificates.

I think the point on Java was a general one and didn’t just relate to Netsurf :-)

This thread will, I hope, continue to discuss some ideas about RISC OS and where TBA can get involved. I think my wider point was one of getting to a stable release at some point where the core applications (web-browser, networking, etc) all work out of the box in a typical configuration. This then can become a reference that anyone new can use to start development. I’ll certainly do my best to help with this as my understanding of everything increases.

Tone is difficult in the written form, and my comments are most definitely not a criticism of the great work all of the volunteers are doing in developing RISC OS. I’m as keen as anyone to attract developers back, or across from other platforms, and making life as easy as possible to get started always helps.

making life as easy as possible to get started always helps.

Are you aware of the packaging projects? -

http://www.riscpkg.org/
http://alanb.drobe.co.uk/packman.htm

It would be great if your stuff were available via it.

Has anyone successfully downloaded TBAFS? I just get a blank screen when clicking on the download link (same behaviour for both links in the docs.google.com view). Tried with IE and FF. Maybe it needs NetSurf ;-)

It appears to download okay using Firefox on Windows.

Hmmm. Do you have a Google account, Vince? I now know several people who have the same problem as I have.

Anyway, if you could email me your download, I would be very happy. Still have large TBAFS archives on my Risc PC, and there was never a comparable Image FS available for later machines…

The only requirement that I am aware of is SSL for our downloads (our Google Apps area forces SSL in the configuration). SSL needs the correct date and time plus up to date root certificates (on Windows at least).

I’ve tested downloading on all major browsers on Windows and it’s fine both anonymous and logged in to a Google account. I can’t test on RISC OS as I only have the BB XM (Netsurf SSL etc).

I just guess we’ll have to get a non SSL downloads area outside of Google.

If anyone needs a copy just email me and I’ll send it over.

Steve: on a related note to you (and other NetSurf developers) not having access to a Beagle Board, I’ve created this bounty…

Hmmm. Do you have a Google account, Vince? I now know several people who have the same problem as I have.

I do – and in the interests of science, I’ve just tried downloading the file in a couple of browsers (Opera and MSIE) that weren’t logged in. In each case, the final download link gives a 404 – the only successful download was when using a browser that’s logged in to my Google account.

Anyway, if you could email me your download, I would be very happy. Still have large TBAFS archives on my Risc PC, and there was never a comparable Image FS available for later machines…

Done.

Steve: on a related note to you (and other NetSurf developers) not having access to a Beagle Board, I’ve created this bounty

For what it’s worth, since I have both an ARMini and a Beagleboard, I was considering the possibility that because they’re both so small, I could start bringing two computers along to shows – but as it happens, fitting all this stuff in my car is no longer an issue (which is why them being small was a consideration for that) so I still can bring two computers – but I can make it the Iyonix and the ARMini.

Which means my Beagleboard is spare – I’d be more than happy to lend it to other developers. (Though being lazy, it’s still boxed – it may be that whoever borrows it first will have to set it up).

but I can make it the Iyonix and the ARMini

In our experience, we would advise caution. We used to bring both of the ROOL Iyonixes to shows and it seems that they don’t take particularly well to travelling. They are already quite sensitive devices now that they are getting on a bit. We stick to bringing Beagle Boards along now.

In our experience, we would advise caution. We used to bring both of the ROOL Iyonixes to shows and it seems that they don’t take particularly well to travelling. They are already quite sensitive devices now that they are getting on a bit. We stick to bringing Beagle Boards along now.

Eek! I’ve brought it to every show I’ve attended since buying it (most years just Wakefield, but from last year Midlands and London as well). =:o

I should’ve also said YMMV.

Yeah, don’t worry – I realised that. Actually, I wonder if it varies with model (ie case design), as much as anything else – mine is the smallest, most compact model: The Aria. Also, the fact that it’s useage age is considerably lower than its physical age might possibly play a part.

Anyway, that’s going off topic. The offer still stands for the availability of my Beagleboard on a loan basis – but since making that original offer, I have had an alternative request that would mean the loan availability would be delayed for a few months. So, if someone does want to borrow it, they need to say ASAP: If nobody says they want to use it, I’ll deal with the request I’ve had first. (The loan offer should then be back in place by, probably, the London show).

With regard to the downloads it appears to be caused a recently introduced Google bug and we’re not the only ones with the problem

Anon access for zip downloads is perhaps not in the Google ethos of monitoring everything anyone ever does and recording it forever :-) Hopefully Google will get it fixed shortly or I’ll have to move the downloads to a place that isn’t so nicely integrated.

Our blog is reporting all our slow but steady progress. Currently I have some VFP/SIMD test code up and running through the BASIC assembler although my head hurts from all the reading of ARM manuals.

Hi Alan,

download works now! Thanks (to you or to Google) ;-)

Some info is available at www.tbasoftware.co.uk and progress will be reported there.

Alan, the Donate thingy on the blog doesn’t seem to link to PayPal with a specified email address. Is this intentional? Are donors supposed to manually specify one of these addresses?

Alan, the Donate thingy on the blog doesn’t seem to link to PayPal with a specified email address

I think I must have broken the HTML. Just created a new button and refreshed it and it appears to be working now.

Thanks for letting me know!

TBAFS 26bit has been released for download

This version is 26bit only and is the original 1.01 release from 1996. It is tested on RISC OS 3.x and requires the Acorn toolbox modules for the UI.