How to add new translation of interface to non-UK language

Have uploaded what I have ready. Is the complete skeleton app. Only the German translation is a real one.
With the needed tools but without the sources.
All complete will be comming soon.
Feel free to take a look at RISC OS Berlin. Feedback is welcome.

@Raik

I have had a look and I can appreciate how much you have achieved, but I cannot help feeling that is still trapped within the constraints of the Territory system.

A request:

While I was doing my little LangRes yesterday I found that some of the later BASIC errors had not been translated in the source. ¹

I mentioned earlier that I had thrown some stuff at Google translate for my Region work, just to ‘look right’ in different languages. So, today I have taken the errors straight out of the UK Messages file and translated them, but I have no idea how they read to a native. Do these seem ok?

# Google Translate
E115:Schlechte FP-Präzision
E116:Schlechte Bildschirmtiefe
E117:END= nicht erlaubt innerhalb von DIM LOCAL
E118:%0 kann nicht als VFP/NEON-Gleitkomma-Direktkonstante dargestellt werden. Der nächste geeignete Gleitkommawert ist %1
E119: Interne VFP-Fehlanpassung
E120:VFP-Skalar-Offset außerhalb des Bereichs
E121:VFP-Skalar darf sich in der Registerliste nicht ändern
E122:Zu viele Register in der Liste
E123: Label/Offset muss wortausgerichtet sein
E124:Ungültige Rechenoperation
# Original English
E115:Bad FP precision
E116:Bad screen depth
E117:END= not allowed within DIM LOCAL
E118:%0 cannot be represented as a VFP/NEON floating point immediate constant. Nearest suitable floating point value is %1
E119:VFP internal mismatch
E120:VFP scalar offset out of range
E121:VFP scalar must not change in register list
E122:Too many registers in list
E123:Label/offset must be word aligned
E124:Invalid arithmetic operation

¹ This was actually a bit more complicated, because the German BASIC Messages has not been updated to include the errors, so I had to hunt them down in the remnants of BASICTrans.

@Raik: Had a play this morning – looks promising.

Boot needs to set Territory$Dir

I did get an ‘Unknown variable at line 210’ (in German) in the TConfig app, but can’t reproduce it.

Is there a hard-wired reference to $.!Territory somewhere in your system or is that the one that’s hard-wired into RISC OS? I have a system with multiple !Boot directories tucked away in subdirectories, that I can edit a $.!Boot obey file to refer to a particular one for testing on a vanilla system or development environment, and so would like a !Territory in each of them. It might be best for !Territory to sit alongside the !Boot directory rather than in $ so refer to <Boot$Dir>.^.!Territory ?

Filer dialogue box captions aren’t translated.

We are somewhat hampered by RISC OS’ all-or-nothing approach in how resources are expected to be loaded. If a new string is added to any application’s/module’s Messages/Res/Templates, it makes life difficult downstream. [In Fireworkz for Windows, I have the UK English resources bound to the executable, loading country-specific resources (DLLs) as needed. But if I can’t find the resource in the loaded DLL, I can always fall back to the one in the executable.]

Aside: Having spotted the ‘Switzerland’ territory that’s available in Raik’s bundle, it immediately sprang to mind that’s a really dumb thing. Yet here we have it in PRM5a: “The following extra countries are supported from RISC OS 3.5 onwards: … Switzerland” having previously stated in PRM3: “For example, to properly support the whole of Switzerland you would need a separate territory for each of the languages used.” :-)

Sorry I’m a bit busy this weekend. I try to answer, but will be a short one.

@Steve
Basic is one of (m)any Google Translation I not really changed. In this parts I only changes things I was seeing at the “first view” at this time. I do this step by step last few weeks an go on next time by using.
If you take a look in the Message-Dump inside the !Territory.7.Messages – Folder with an editor, you find the same lines ;-)
Two problems I have often. The error phrases are not one-to-one. Without the context, you can easy translate nonsens.
E116:Bad screen depth = Schlechte Bildschirmtiefe = 1:1 but what it means? Colour depth? Resolution? Screen Mode?
Right or wrong depends on the context.

@Stuart

I did get an ‘Unknown variable at line 210’ (in German) in the TConfig app, but can’t reproduce it.

Line 210 is PROCopenwindow. And open the window from template. Maybe the app_dir$ is not sert right if you try to use without restart.

Is there a hard-wired reference to $.!Territory somewhere

The way is described in the BonusBinDev/zip.HardDisc4.Modules.Territories.ReadMe/txt.
The reference is in every standard HardDisc4 Image.
Look at !Boot.Utils.BootRun… You find IfThere <Boot$Dir>.^.!Territory
If !Territory was found… Territory$Dir will be set.

Filer dialogue box captions aren’t translated.

Where? I’m “operational blind”.

‘Switzerland’ territory

Is the same for Austria. The modules are not in the ROOL BonusBinDev. Read inside the “30” and “35” folder. This are dummys and fall back to “7”.
Since I use the old Territory-App on Risc PC (A5000 it was in ROM but the same, I mean), Austria and Switzerland means the “German” part. So I “build in” without “build in” ;-)

I forget. You can use !Territory as an App. In Choices.Territory you find setter. Set the territory-variable. The variable is needed to find the right folder in Territory. If this variable is set and !Territory was seen by the filer, you can start it from every place, every time. So you can alse change the translation “on the fly”…

I think it’d be easier if you tested for the existence of the Territory variable that is Set by setter, rather than for the existence of the setter file itself, e.g

If "<Territory>"="" Then 'fallback to 1' Else 'use <Territory>'

One point for you… ;-)

If you take a look in the Message-Dump inside the !Territory.7.Messages – Folder with an editor, you find the same lines ;-) Two problems I have often. The error phrases are not one-to-one. Without the context, you can easy translate nonsens.

So I do. Google Translate looks to me as though it does a decent job, but everything has to be checked by a native, which is the big problem. I was surprised how well it dealt with tokens and keywords.

The Switzerland territory illustrates perfectly the big limitation of the Territory method.

One point for you… ;-)

I will put it in the small pile of points that I have accrued over the years – they are all cherished.

checked by a native

Amusingly, we paid for a professional translation of PipeDream 3 (software and manuals) to German, but got some criticism from German Germans as our translator was a Swiss German!

I’ve found Google Translate to be a big help.

Edit: I just tried with !Territory alongside my !Boot in a subdirectory having used the tool to configure Territory 7. Think that it’s one of the RISC OS modules that then fails on reboot, preventing startup, trying to load files from $.!Territory.7… Unhelpfully something in boot had disabled Escape so my attempts to copy the error messages and *Show Territory* down using *Build failed as I couldn’t close the temporary file! Or press Break, Alt-Break, or even Ctrl-Break. Grrr. Power cycle. Oh dear, my temporary file is full of subversion entries. Best check disc, I might be a while…

The Datafile is loades by the module Messages2. My mistake. The module search the file in $.!Territory… I’m back to standard and forget :-(
Have you try
*Spool output
At the beginning of !Territory !Run to store the messages?

I have try from a subfolder. The only mistake is that no messages will be add to RessourceFS. Not fine but no bigger problems.

Can you describe your boot process? I not really understand …

Here we are:

Trying to load resources from file $.!Territory.7.Resources.trl00052900
Loading resources from file $.!Territory.7.Resources.trl00050000 FAILED
File not found

I have the !Boot folder, Apps etc. and now !Territory in a subfolder, let’s say iMX6-Dev.

I have a $.!Boot Obey file which Runs $.iMX6-Dev.!Boot

Is Messages2. Will take a look to sourcecode. But as I wrote, this weekend there is not enough sparetime.

Your boot seems pretty special and not standard. How should I be prepared for that?

Thanks for looking anyhow. Don’t bother too much with my setup – I doubt many other will be doing similar.

Please try this version. Remove the old one from !Territory.Modules and use the new one. “$.!Territory” is changed to “<territory$dir>”. Territory-var must be set.

Please try this version. Remove the old one from !Territory.Modules and use the new one. “$.!Territory” is changed to “<territory$dir>”. Territory-var must be set.

That one’s a winner – seems to work as I’d hoped. Thanks!

Google Translate looks to me as though it does a decent job

Since I posted that a week ago I have been having merry time seeing what is needed to use it.

After a lot of fiddling I have got a semi-automatic process for translating all the ResourceFS Messages and Res files at one go. I have left out the !Help files, and Templates await something that will export and import their text.

I have bundled this up with a manual summarising the process in LangRes , which includes a module to translate into French.

This is still very much a work in progress, with the likelihood of many errors, and I cannot comment on the suitability of the translation, but I would be very interested to know what anyone thinks.

LangRes operates entirely separately from the Territory mechanism.