Running !Squeak and !Scratch

The DDE must check it is running on a Pi by looking at the system and hence the older NutPi version can’t run

Sounds like the restriction that was described.

as it does not have the newer v1.2 processor/system it it’s code.

Nope, identifies the hardware as not being a match and simply pops up a message then stops.

Done quite deliberately to lock the software to the hardware platform as it’s a cheap software bundle to go with the cheap hardware. I believe the newer version of the software bundle works on all models of Pi.

Tim presumably bought the bundle to use more than just the DDE element and should note that many (not all) of the NutPi bundle packages are similarly locked.

Steve

Thanks for the explanation.

Sounds like email required to Sales as per the news announcement I copied and £12.50 or find an older model in his collection.

OK, I got the damn compiler to work, changed the way the pixel translation table is (or is not, as appropriate) made and used. It works at the naive level of just running it and my debug printf’s show it all doing things in a logical order.

Now what? How do I test for this zero page nonsnese?

What version and date of RISC OS are you running?
ZeroPain was introduced in May 2015 in the development RISC OS v5.23.
See https://www.riscosopen.org/forum/forums/1/topics/3418 for details.
Recent v5.23 ROM downloads have an improved version of ZeroPain, and include some documentation about how it works and the logs.

As for how to test for problems (and they are real problems, not nonsense!) you should just exercise as many program paths as you can and investigate any ZP logs.

As for how to test for problems (and they are real problems, not nonsense!)

That’s one of the problems. Perception.
A fair number of people don’t seem to realise that the change has highlighted the cause of quite a number of “now you see me, now you don’t” bugs that had developers puzzled about why some people experienced problems at random intervals.
The Zeropain module is probably one of the most useful RO bug finding tools to appear in a couple of decades.

That’s wierd; I added a message last night (canada time) to say I had finally worked out how to get the zeropain thing active and that after running the 3000+ item test suite there are no reports of issues. Did your forum server crash recently?

That’s wierd; I added a message last night (canada time) to say I had finally worked out how to get the zeropain thing active and that after running the 3000+ item test suite there are no reports of issues.

Good news, probably worth putting that up on the web site for others to poke to death and see if it’s similarly stable on other board versions.

Did your forum server crash recently?

The forum server has been showing direly slow response at intervals for some time now and the incidences of failed postings and duplicates is the stuff of legend.

the incidences of failed postings and duplicates is the stuff of legend.

It’s called Beast for a reason…

As the person who origonally posted the issue and also contacted Tim I’d like to publically thank him for his efforts in getting !Squeak working again.

Us in MUG are also looking at how we can further help Tim stay supporting !Squeak and possibly !Scratch as it is always great when someone who hasn’t done anything on RISC OS for a while spends the time and effort getting things working again.

Thank you Tim

MUG are also looking at how we can further help Tim stay supporting !Squeak

If I ever get my new RPi working I’ll start using !Scratch to support the effort going into preparations for the Regression fair.

I’ve been frantically busy over the weekend, so no progress on repackaging !Scratch, but Doug has confirmed the revised !Squeak is ok for him.

In principle I can make a full Cog/Spur version (as in dynamic translation and new faster object memory design, see squeak.org for details) if we can work out some tricky details about atomic 64bit value access, timer interrupts to trigger process switch checks and so on. That would make things 5-10X faster, depending upon your choice of benchmarks

Hello, From reading through the thread it sounds like !Squeak is working on the Pi but is there a download of this working version yet?

www.squeakvm.org/riscos

Version 4.4 is what you need.

I’ve tried the 4.4 version as well and I get the same error. I’m using the latest RISC OS Rom running on Pi 1 model B. Do I need to take the plunge and buy a new Pi?

What error exactly?

Hi Steve -Here is the detailed error message. I’m afraid it doesn’t mean a lot to me.

2 7e9c in function SetupPixelTranslationTable
Aryl; Ox0004ded4 319188 → L00000000 0×201b78d9 Ox00000001 0×00000320]
87ec in function CreateSprite
Arg4: AxAAAAAA2A 32 → [Oxe92d500f AxelaAAAA9 Oxela01000 AxeeA7Af9a]
Arg3: 8×00000258 600 → [0×00010000 Ox800037f9 AxfcAl984A Oxfc0124a0]
Arg2: 8×00000320 800 → [Axe5lffAA4 Ax2AAA9754 Axe5lffAA4 0×2000975c]
Argl; AxAAA4ded4 319188 → E00000000 9×201b78d9 8×00000001 8×00000320]
2 8c04 in function CreateDisplayBitmap
Arg5: 00000000 A
Arg4: Ox00000020 32 → [Oxe92d500f Oxela00009 Oxela0100c AxeeA7Af9a]
Arg3: 8×00000258 600 → [0×00010000 Ox800037f9 Oxfc019840 Oxfc0124a0]
Arg2: 8×00000320 8AA → [Axe5lffAA4 Ax2AAA9754 Axe5lffAA4 Ox2000975c]
Argl: AxAAflaSfc 15836668 → [Axffffffff Axffffffff Axffffffff Axffffffff]
2 8e4c in function ioShowDisplayOnWindow
Arg5: 00000000 A
Arg4: AxAAAAAA2A 32 → [Oxe92d500f Oxela00009 AxelaAlAAc AxeeA7Af9a]
Arg3: 8×00000258 600 → [0×00010000 Ox800037f9 Oxfc019840 Oxfc0124a01
Arg2: 8×00000320 8AA → [Axe5lffAA4 Ax2AAA9754 Axe5lffAA4 8×2000975c]
Aryl: AxAAfla5fc 15836668 → [Axffffffff Axffffffff Axffffffff Oxffffffff1
29434 in function ioShowDisplay
Arg5: 8×00000258 600 → [0×00010000 0×800037f9 8xfc019840 Oxfc0124a0]
Arg4: 8×00000320 800 → [Axe5lffAA4 0×20009754 Axe5lffAA4 8×20009750]
Arg3: 00000000 0
Arg2: 00000000 0
Argl: 0×0008cd68 576872 → [8×46848121 Ox00fla5f8 8×00000641 Ox000004b1]
bc4c in function displayBits0fLeftTopRightBottom
ldel0 in function primitiveShowDisplayRect
fc3c in function interpret
Arg2: 0×00040204 311812 → E0x0004021c 8×0004c233 8×00040240 88888888]
Aryl: 8×00000003 3
98a8 in function main
Arg2: Ox00008fb4 36788 → [0xela0c00d Axe92ddbe3 Oxe24cb004 Oxe15d000a]
Arg1: AxAAA4bceA 310496 → E0x7571533c 8×246b6165 8×3e726944 0×7552212e1
fc16d930 in shared library function
2a2e8 in anonymous function

Hi Andrew

When you say latest build for the Pi do you mean RC15 or a beta ROM?

Also if it is a beta ROM then have you got ZeroPain loaded.

Finally you are trying to load it by double clicking on the file endimg in /image not the application?

Hi Doug

I’m using the RC15 ROM. I have tried a couple of older ROMs too thinking that maybe they would work better the older Pi but I haven’t tried a beta yet so I could give that a go.

The error is from when I double click on the file ending in /image.

Thank you all for the assistance.

Hi Andrew

Have you installed !DeepKeys and Sharedsound buffers applications as well?

Doug

Yes I’ve installed !DeepKeys first rebooted and then installed Sharedsound rebooted again then tried double clicking the squeak image file.

I will give it a go with a beta ROM and report back the results.

Which model of the Pi and ROM are you using Doug?

Hi Andrew

I have tried RC15 on my Pi1 B with !Squeak 4.4 and get the error you have.

I have got !Squeak working on RC15 by first double clicking on the !Squeak application and getting an error box up saying it could open the image file. Then once the text file comes up after cancelling that error box try double clicking on /image file and it should open.

Occasionally I get “Unable to move memory” errors and then lock ups so it might be something to do with RC15?

Do you have a RTC add on as well.

Doug

Andrew

I’ve noticed the !Runiamge in the 4.4 download is dated 2013 not Dec2017 so perhaps the changed file has not been uploaded to the webpage.

I’ll send an email to Tim to let him know.

In the meantime if you update to the latest Beta rom and firmware then it will work. Chris Hall has a fairly recent upodate ready to drop the files in to the Loader directory within !Boot.

Andrew

Tim has now updated the website with the latest version that should work on both a Low and High vector ROM.

www.squeakvm.org/riscos/

Thank you Doug and Tim, Squeak is now running for me with the updated version.