Hasta la vista, baby!
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Steve Pampling (1551) 8172 posts |
Russia “merely” wants to establish the “proper” governance of the territory from Lisbon to Vladivostok. No trace of empire building there. |
Clive Semmens (2335) 3276 posts |
It’s an interesting conundrum, and the sword to cut the Gordian knot is the realization that support for Israel is very far from universal amongst Jews, indeed very many of us regard the Israeli government as a serious embarrassment. Expressing such an opinion can get one chucked out of the Labour Party – which has happened to quite a few Jews under Starmer’s leadership. Hmmm indeed. |
Rick Murray (539) 13850 posts |
Leftpondian ways, my mother mostly dated Jewish guys 1 (she was their little shiksa 2). I asked her about it, and she said she had no answer other than they seemed like decent people to get to know. 3 So, yeah, I know the situation is complicated. That’s why any time I have said anything about Israel, I’ve been very careful not to reference Jews. They might like to believe they speak for all of Judaism. They don’t.
Does nothing, he’s an arse and people will scream. It’s one of those sorts of situations, isn’t it? Once you’ve read the footnotes, it’s freaky to think that this stuff that we think is so ancient and old fashioned twaddle was mom’s childhood. She was a teenager when MLK had his dream… 1 Which explains why the odd Yiddish word turns up in stuff I write. Like that drawer in the kitchen where odds and ends go is a drawer of hazarai. It’s exactly the right word. 2 She was well aware that it was a derogatory phrase, she was trolling those who didn’t approve. 3 Crowning moment of awesome. Grandma 4 ditched her original country club because they started to let black people in. When mom hit a milestone (18? 21?) granddad invited her to a special meal at the new country club with a friend. The place had a strict No Blacks No Jews policy. So she went to her Jewish friends (half of them were in a jazz band together) and hatched a plan to make up a fake identity for the most orthodox boy willing to actually go. And so “Eddie” (real name Israel!) was her date. Granddad knew (he knew the boy’s father) and said absolutely nothing as it was a very mom thing to do 5. 🖕 to racist twats. 4 She would have been exactly Driving Miss Daisy except she was a control freak and didn’t want anybody else telling her where to go. The household did have “help” (in other words, a coloured maid) who did a much better job of raising mom that her real mother ever managed. 5 That, and the fact that she was basically Scout (To Kill A Mockingbird). Oversized dresses? Stuff that, I’ll wear my brother’s dungarees! Which to a Methodist family in the fifties would have brought shame to the entire family, relatives, neighbours, the whole town… So much shame. ;) All because a girl didn’t want to dress in stupid girl clothes. I mean, dresses and buckle shoes are not practical for climbing trees. A girl climbing trees? REPENT! ARGH! |
Clive Semmens (2335) 3276 posts |
You’re a wise man, and dead right.
Indeed. Corbyn had the same problem, surprise surprise. Whatever else one might think about either Corbyn or Starmer, at least Corbyn sided with the “wrong kind of Jews”… 8~) (I’m the wrong kind of Jew, and proud to be so…one who has no time for far right, racist Jews (or far right, racist anyone else)…) |
Steve Pampling (1551) 8172 posts |
Substitute another religion for Judaism in that, it makes no great difference. Yours truly looks at religious groups and alternately sighs, and growls. |
Clive Semmens (2335) 3276 posts |
^ This. Maybe I should mention that I’m an ethnic Jew, not a religious one! Not that the Israeli government represents all religious Jews, either – in particular, huge numbers of orthodox Jews (both in Israel and around the world) oppose the Israeli government’s policies and actions. |
Steve Pampling (1551) 8172 posts |
There’s probably a believer vs. zealot divide to consider too. Although many of the latter are better labelled as hypocrites. BTW. I’d describe you as a RISC OS and Apple(IIRC) user who writes software and prose, and Judaism seems to have been a hobby of your antecedents. |
Clive Semmens (2335) 3276 posts |
Thanks, Steve – I hope and believe that’s a very fair & understanding description. Your father sounds to have been made in the same mould as mine, and I’ve tried to follow in his footsteps: http://clive.semmens.org.uk/Opinion/Religion.html (Incidentally, while I generally describe myself as an ethnic Jew, it’s a moot point. So far as the state of Israel – and the Nazis – are concerned, I’m Jewish. The state of Israel “grants” people like me the “right of return.” To a country none of my ancestors have lived in for many generations, very likely for well over a thousand years. But so far as some religious Jews are concerned, I’m not Jewish at all, because my mother wasn’t. Nor for that matter was my father’s father. But my father was, because his mother was… My grandmother was a BIG influence during my formative years though. She was culturally very Jewish, and a devout atheist. (I use the word “devout” advisedly there…)) |
Frederick Bambrough (1372) 837 posts |
I wouldn’t concern myself over that. They would think the same of me and my mother was. |
Clive Semmens (2335) 3276 posts |
I don’t concern myself over it at all, don’t worry! 8~) I am who I am, and fairly comfortable in my skin… |
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