Drive Icon Query.

I’ve modified my RPi to add a 4 port hub to fit inside the “Iceberry” style case. One of these extra ports is hardwired to connect to a 16Gb USB stick inside the case.
On the Icon bar, it shows as the sandy coloured “harddisc” system icon, but any other USB stick I have to hand shows up as a blue USB icon. For the following I’m using SanDisk Cruzer Edge 16Gb dismantled as the wired and a SanDisk Cruzer Edge 32Gb, slightly older USB stick, same original shaped package.
MENU button on each after boot has the header
“SCSI::4” and “SCSI::0”
Both were not re-formatted before this issue arose, but I have since used HForm on the “internal” drive.
On selecting both drives I now get a filer window with
“SCSI::HardDisc4.$” and “Fat32fs::PiDrive.$”

Just copied 5Gb Scumm files to see if used size makes any difference. Posting this so I don’t lose it, testing and rebooting

‘Removable’ drives are given an ‘SD’ icon on the icon bar and do not have their name underneath.
‘Fixed’ drives are given a ‘drive’ icon on the icon bar and have their name underneath.
Is your 16Gb USB stick an ‘SSD’ unit?
or maybe it reports itself as ‘fixed’
We have one that is!

I wonder if now is a good time to discuss if the treatment of ‘Removable’ & ‘Fixed’ drives needs updating to reflect the new situation that drive 0: can be 64GB/128GB and the fastest storage in a system?

Just rebooted. Added 2.5" HD MEDION Drive-n-Go to spare RPi lower USB socket. Shows as sandy “HardDisc” icon. MENU button gives title as SCSI::5. MENU/Free shows
Free ?
Used ?
Size 905M
This may be a SCSIFS >2GB thing. I’m aware of that.
Now clicked select on it and filer window title is “Fat32::DRIVE-N-GO.$” and MENU/Free now shows
Free 47Gb
Used 186Gb
Size 233Gb

To confuse the issue, 8Gb Acorn format shows as “SCSI::Archive.$” and MENU/Free shows correct info and blue USB icon.

Same PC format 8Gb stick shows as
“Fat32fs::ADATA UFD.$”. MENU/Free shows correct info and blue USB icon.

Why does one 16Gb USB stick have harddrive icon and every other stick show as USB drive?

The USB stick that seems to appear as a “HardDisk” is a SanDisk USB Cruzer Edge 16Gb that I bought last Wednesday.
The virtually identical USB stick, that appears as blue USB icon, I bought a couple of months ago is a Sandisk USB Cruzer Edge 32Gb in identical plastic package. (Until I removed the former PCB!)

What does !USBInfo report?

Is this what you are looking for?
I think Device 7 is the 16G drive in question and drive 6 at the end is the 32G drive.

EDIT! Sorry, That was rushed and has come out badly!
Working on it!
EDIT+1 That’s more readable.
EDIT+2 There are four devices plugged into extension hub, Keyboard, Mouse and two similar memory sticks.

I get the same info for both drives, the only difference seems to be the serial number. (To be expected.)

USB Status Report
Saved Mon,07 Apr 2014.21:16:46 by USBinfo


FS : USB
 Bus: 1
   Device: 1
      DeviceFS  : USB1
      USB spec  : 2.00
      Class     : 9     Hub
      Subclass  : 0     Unused
      Protocol  : 1     Single TT
      MaxPacket : 64
      Vendor    : 0000
      Product   : 0000
      Release   : 1.00
      Speed     : Hi-speed (480 Mb/s)
      NumConfigs: 1

      Config: 1
         MaxPower  : 0 mA
         Attributes: (Self-powered)
         Interfaces: 1

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 9     Hub
            Subclass  : 0     Unused
            Protocol  : 0     Full speed (or root) hub
            Endpoints : 1

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Interrupt
               MaxPacket : 8
               Interval  : 255 ms

   Device: 2
      DeviceFS  : USB2
      USB spec  : 2.00
      Class     : 9     Hub
      Subclass  : 0     Unused
      Protocol  : 2     TT per port
      MaxPacket : 64
      Vendor    : 0424  Standard Microsystems Corp.
      Product   : 9512
      Release   : 2.00
      Speed     : Hi-speed (480 Mb/s)
      NumConfigs: 1

      Config: 1
         MaxPower  : 2 mA
         Attributes: (Self-powered) (Remote Wakeup)
         Interfaces: 1

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 9     Hub
            Subclass  : 0     Unused
            Protocol  : 1     Single TT
            Endpoints : 1

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Interrupt
               MaxPacket : 1
               Interval  : 12 ms

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 1
            Class     : 9     Hub
            Subclass  : 0     Unused
            Protocol  : 2     TT per port
            Endpoints : 1

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Interrupt
               MaxPacket : 1
               Interval  : 12 ms

   Device: 3
      DeviceFS  : USB3
      USB spec  : 2.00
      Class     : 9     Hub
      Subclass  : 0     Unused
      Protocol  : 1     Single TT
      MaxPacket : 64
      Vendor    : 05e3  Genesys Logic, Inc.
      Product   : 0608  USB-2.0 4-Port HUB
      Release   : 32.98
      Speed     : Hi-speed (480 Mb/s)
      NumConfigs: 1

      Config: 1
         MaxPower  : 100 mA
         Attributes: (Self-powered) (Remote Wakeup)
         Interfaces: 1

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 9     Hub
            Subclass  : 0     Unused
            Protocol  : 0     Full speed (or root) hub
            Endpoints : 1

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Interrupt
               MaxPacket : 1
               Interval  : 12 ms

   Device: 4
      DeviceFS  : USB4
      USB spec  : 1.10
      Class     : 0     (Defined at Interface level)
      Subclass  : 0
      Protocol  : 0
      MaxPacket : 8
      Vendor    : 04f3  Elan Microelectronics Corp.
      Product   : 0103
      Release   : 1.07
      Speed     : Low speed (1.5 Mb/s)
      NumConfigs: 1

      Config: 1
         MaxPower  : 100 mA
         Attributes: (Remote Wakeup)
         Interfaces: 2

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 3     Human Interface Device
            Subclass  : 1     Boot Interface Subclass
            Protocol  : 1     Keyboard
            Endpoints : 1

            HID Descriptors available:
               Report (type 0x22, 54 bytes)

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Interrupt
               MaxPacket : 8
               Interval  : 10 ms

         Interface: 1
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 3     Human Interface Device
            Subclass  : 0     No Subclass
            Protocol  : 0     None
            Endpoints : 1

            HID Descriptors available:
               Report (type 0x22, 52 bytes)

            Endpoint: 2
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Interrupt
               MaxPacket : 3
               Interval  : 10 ms

   Device: 7
      DeviceFS  : USB7
      USB spec  : 2.00
      Class     : 0     (Defined at Interface level)
      Subclass  : 0
      Protocol  : 0
      MaxPacket : 64
      Vendor    : 0781  SanDisk Corp.
      Product   : 556b
      Release   : 1.26
      Speed     : Hi-speed (480 Mb/s)
      NumConfigs: 1

      Config: 1
         MaxPower  : 200 mA
         Attributes:
         Interfaces: 1

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 8     Mass Storage
            Subclass  : 6     SCSI
            Protocol  : 80    Bulk (Zip)
            Endpoints : 2

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Bulk
               MaxPacket : 512
               Interval  : -

            Endpoint: 2
               Direction : OUT
               Transfer  : Bulk
               MaxPacket : 512
               Interval  : -

   Device: 8
      DeviceFS  : USB8
      USB spec  : 2.00
      Class     : 255   Vendor Specific Class
      Subclass  : 0
      Protocol  : 1
      MaxPacket : 64
      Vendor    : 0424  Standard Microsystems Corp.
      Product   : ec00
      Release   : 2.00
      Speed     : Hi-speed (480 Mb/s)
      NumConfigs: 1

      Config: 1
         MaxPower  : 2 mA
         Attributes: (Self-powered) (Remote Wakeup)
         Interfaces: 1

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 255   Vendor Specific Class
            Subclass  : 0
            Protocol  : 255
            Endpoints : 3

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Bulk
               MaxPacket : 512
               Interval  : -

            Endpoint: 2
               Direction : OUT
               Transfer  : Bulk
               MaxPacket : 512
               Interval  : -

            Endpoint: 3
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Interrupt
               MaxPacket : 16
               Interval  : 4 ms

   Device: 5
      DeviceFS  : USB19
      USB spec  : 2.00
      Class     : 0     (Defined at Interface level)
      Subclass  : 0
      Protocol  : 0
      MaxPacket : 8
      Vendor    : 192f  Avago Technologies, Pte.
      Product   : 0916
      Release   : 2.00
      Speed     : Low speed (1.5 Mb/s)
      NumConfigs: 1

      Config: 1
         MaxPower  : 98 mA
         Attributes: (Remote Wakeup)
         Interfaces: 1

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 3     Human Interface Device
            Subclass  : 1     Boot Interface Subclass
            Protocol  : 2     Mouse
            Endpoints : 1

            HID Descriptors available:
               Report (type 0x22, 64 bytes)

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Interrupt
               MaxPacket : 5
               Interval  : 10 ms

   Device: 6
      DeviceFS  : USB23
      USB spec  : 2.00
      Class     : 0     (Defined at Interface level)
      Subclass  : 0
      Protocol  : 0
      MaxPacket : 64
      Vendor    : 0781  SanDisk Corp.
      Product   : 556b
      Release   : 1.26
      Speed     : Hi-speed (480 Mb/s)
      NumConfigs: 1

      Config: 1
         MaxPower  : 200 mA
         Attributes:
         Interfaces: 1

         Interface: 0
         Alternate: 0
            Class     : 8     Mass Storage
            Subclass  : 6     SCSI
            Protocol  : 80    Bulk (Zip)
            Endpoints : 2

            Endpoint: 1
               Direction : IN
               Transfer  : Bulk
               MaxPacket : 512
               Interval  : -

            Endpoint: 2
               Direction : OUT
               Transfer  : Bulk
               MaxPacket : 512
               Interval  : -

I didn’t get a chance today to see what difference pens & SSD drives report. I’ll try and find time tomorrow.

Ok, it doesn’t appear to be a problem, I was just curious as to what was going on.
If it helps I’ve grabbed a screen shot which shows what I’m seeing.

The drives from left to right are:-
250 Gb 2.5" portable hard disc.
16 Gb SanDisk Cruzer Edge USB stick. The drive in question, now formatted with !HForm, but same issue when was first used.
8 Gb ADATA USB stick, original PC format.
8 Gb SanDisk Cruzer Blade USB stick. Original format.
8 Gb ADATA USB stick, RISC OS formatted
32 Gb SanDisk Cruzer Edge USB stick. Original PC format. Virtually identical package to drive with issue.
2 Gb Micro SDcard in adaptor card with RISC OS on.

Is this a ‘number of drives’ effect. Most filing systems used to be limited to drives 0-3, removable and drives 4-7, fixed?

Ah. That makes sense. Well deduced!
Booting without say the 16GB Pen and then inserting it might prove it…. Actually I suspect it won’t, as the system will not expect a Fixed drive to be added. I’d expect it to… I’m not sure!
What does it do?

I’ve already tried that. If it’s the only device plugged in on boot, it shows as fixed drive. I’ve just tried a very similar setup on RPi version 2. The USB hub is an older one with a GL850A chip as opposed to GL850G chip.
Same SD card, but using 32Gb Cruzer stick. Used in each slot it still shows as blue icon. Would try the offending stick, but some halfwit has soldered it in haven’t I! Looks like I’m going to have to remove it.

Update, looks like it’s the stick.
Using out of the box, (not the modified one,) RPi model B, version 2, SD card, power in, HDMI out and nothing else.
Using either USB slot, either plugged in from power up or inserted after, the 16Gb shows as fixed drive. The 32Gb shows up as blue USB.
Still haven’t got a flamin’ clue why!

Just checked our SSD but as it connects via a USB to SATA it doesn’t provide any information.
I suspect you may never find out why.

Using either USB slot, either plugged in from power up or inserted after, the 16Gb shows as fixed drive.

Somewhere in the USB descriptors, just beyond the level you have given us, is more information including declaring the medium as fixed or removable. I don’t think you can get at the descriptor in question from standard RISC OS apps; you’d need a slightly more specialised version.

A USB stick arguably has a fixed medium; you can’t remove the memory medium from the USB device, unlike a card reader for example.

Somewhere in the USB descriptors, just beyond the level you have given us, is more information including declaring the medium as fixed or removable. I don’t think you can get at the descriptor in question from standard RISC OS apps; you’d need a slightly more specialised version.

Indeed. SCSIFS uses the result of the SCSI INQUIRY command (&12) to decide whether a device is ‘fixed’ or ‘removable’.

I have just bought another one to try. It is reduced in Tescos from £13.50 to £10 and behaves the same, (as I expected now.)
What I have found is that when I plug in my multi card reader, I can access all four slots and copy to USB stick. Although that is somewhat pointless as the last one is for Sony memory stick and I only have a 16Mb one of those and no phone to use it on anymore!
Are there any other advantages / disadvantages of one drive over the other?

Following further investigations, the 16Gb stick also appears as a fixed drive on a PC running Vista.
Trying running two RPis on the same network.
Enabled network and access from the boot config on both.
With only the wired stick, I get share as an option and if selected, I can read it on the second RPi.
Now plugged in second stick and share is greyed out for that one. Still in PC format though.
Used !HForm.
Now whichever drive is registered first, as SCSI::4 can be shared, but not the other one in SCSI::5.
The wired drive is in a higher USB slot than any I plug in.

The same applies if I use a 250Gb portable harddrive instead.
I can also share RAMdiscs if they have unique names.
Is there any reason why “removable” drives or those not in SCSI::4 can’t be shared?

You mean “share” via ShareFS? Just use the command “*share”. Don’t know why it is not supported via the drive icon.

I share up to three drives from my BeagleBoard and PandaBoard, and two from the Pi, but in all cases they are shared using the *share command, rather than from the drive icon, which I think, without checking, that the menu option is greyed out.

Is there any reason why “removable” drives or those not in SCSI::4 can’t be shared?

You can’t share ‘removable’ drives from the iconbar menu since you might remove them whilst someone else on the network is accessing them. The *Share command still works though, so you can put that in an Obeyfile and either double-click it or make it part of your boot sequence.

You can’t share ‘removable’ drives from the iconbar menu since you might remove them whilst someone else on the network is accessing them.

The ability to disconnect the machine from the network or switch it off has always existed and has the same effect.
The ability to share from the command line rather makes a mockery of the limitation.
Either “do, or do not” as the saying goes. I can share a Memphis “disc” which is pretty ephemeral.

Thanks, *share works fine.

The ability to share from the command line rather makes a mockery of the limitation.

I agree. I also think not putting the drive name under the icon on the iconbar for removable drives needs to be updated

Although the limitation reduces the chances of someone just clicking and sharing drives without understanding the implications, whereas if you know how to use the * command, you may be more aware of what that involves.

Although the limitation reduces the chances of someone just clicking and sharing drives without understanding the implications, whereas if you know how to use the * command, you may be more aware of what that involves.

What it involves for most users is knowing that the GUI won’t do everything so just use this little obey file someone else created to get around the GUI “not working properly”¹
Knowledge of the underlying elements – bugger all.

¹ At work there are competent techies that don’t know VBScript and happily use one of a number of items I put together. They know the end result, they don’t know the how and if it doesn’t work – my phone rings.